Mr. Kane a registered republican came bringing flowers to a recent meeting of the once mighty but recently diminished city Republican committee. Painting a picture of sunshine and roses Pat praised the virtues of a professional unelected City Manager.
Describing Watertown NY as a virtual utopia of the north under a city manager.A place where well scrubbed children play while properious parents shop for the latest Beemer. The truth is a little different
So what does Watertown NY have that we don’t have? Well they have similar small town problems such as
Breaking NewsJudge orders halt to sale of alleged synthetic drugs at Watertown shop 4:10 pm, Wed., Jul. 11
Two teenagers charged with burglary 4:10 pm, Wed., Jul. 11
Motorcyclist injured in collision with deer in Ellisburg 9:21 am, Wed., Jul. 11
They also have 25 thousand solders in nearby Fort Drum.And to keep them from getting bored they have Stackel's Love Shack. Watertown, NY 13601.
Now that is something we don’t have.
In fairness where ever you have large military base you will have some seedy establishments but it is a nice little town when it’s not buried in snow. But it ain’t no Saratoga and don’t let Pat tell you he’s a republican either. Pat helped democratic Val Keehn when Scott ran against her. He helped democrat Ron Kim when he ran against Johnson and hell he was the campaign manager of Brent Wilkes when he ran against the Republican Johnson. I think this guy really doesn’t like Johnson. Really I truly believe Pat [who I personally like as an individual} is so blinded by his anger against Johnson he would back a coup against the man. So just keep an open mind when he comes bringing flowers to your group in the coming months.
Then ask yourself is this about good government or about Pat carrying a grudge?
32 comments:
I live in Watertown. We have had good city managers and bad city managers, good elected councilmen/women and mostly bad ones. They key is - elected or hired - that the people are good ones - smart - working hard - to do what is right for the city. If the people are ego driven, selfish, not smart and not working their ass off to do what is right for the city - then drama, fraud, waste, stupidity and corruption will follow.
We also invented the tooth brush in Watertown. If it were invented anywhere else it would be called the teeth brush.
Most of the committee weren't even paying attention to Mr. Kane,don't worry the committee knows the many faces of Mr. Kane and besides it's common knowledge through out the City that this is a "GRUDGE CAMPAIGHN"against Mayor Johnson,a cult insider who will remain annomyous said that the latest city manager to speak at a lightly turn out at the library was very impressed with saratoga springs and the way it is run.... she really didn't understand why she was here!
7:23am, you sound like a disclaimer.
Oh heavens! Citizen Clancy has retired from her Basement Blogger past time. She even thanks her "hundreds" of supporters. Then she wrote a few anonymous sappy comments, pretending to be a few of those hundreds!
The word is she is now Pat Kane's Communications Director! It's only costing Pat a box of new crayons, so why not?
Or did John hire her?
She's Pat's constant companion in this overthrow attempt...the dynamic duo..lol!
John, take the cross away and that guy actually looks like you getting ready for the ballet. I spoke with a Republican Committee person this morning and they were very INTERESTED. Ask them what they think of Scott Johnson. One question for you though, were you ever asked to speak before the Republican about anything? At least Kane can say he was invited. For someone who has been shunned and dismissed by you own Democratic friends after you 'started the Democrat meeting at Mama Mia's) which is run by none other than your friend Tom McTygue, you sure know how to empty a room. Just sayin.
I believe that Schenectady, New York was under the city manager form of government when the politicians still managed to give away the store to some of the city employees such as police. Professional management sounds good but it is no panacea.
The largest problem is that the Charter Change folks are running "AGAINST" Saratoga. They will tell you why this town is broken and will be better under the professional system.
The reality is that every form of government can be improved, but their "hacked together" charter proposal is poorly written and poorly conceived.
For example, how do you fire the City Manager? While that person supposedly serves at the decision of the Council, she/he can then ask for an Open Meeting to dispute their firing. So, make the Council testify that the current Manager is "too slow" or "not responsive". Won't happen...
So, instead the City Manager will get $500K to $700 as walk away money. Why not write something that gives the person 3 months salary without cause and 0 with cause.
And, the Salary. City Charter folks say we can get this person for $105K to $120K - which is what a police/fire officer makes. No way we will get a great person for that - plus companies like Wilkes actually consult/advise and help recruit his pals to apply.
This is a bad proposal for a town that is in pretty good shape. Yuk on you Kane and Wilkes.
7:23am got it right. It does not matter which model we have. If boneheads are running it, it won't work.
1:56 First of all you have to prove the Manager will walk away with $$500K to $700. Where does it say that and who said it? What expertise do you have that you can say "but their "hacked together" charter proposal is poorly written and poorly conceived". An international Managers Association with 15,000 Managers that are members will give the Council a list of candidates and they will choose who will get the post, who told you "companies like Wilkes actually consult/advise and help recruit his pals to apply."
Any meeting I ever attended not once did anyone mention they were running "AGAINST" Saratoga, if you went to a meeting and heard this you most likely were in the wrong room and if you didn't attend any meetings who told you this? The message I got was that the Government needed streamlining, why do we need 5 payroll clerks? Why do we need a reported 16 copy machines? Why pay workers 15 minutes on City time so they can cash paychecks? Who is responsible for long range planning? Who resolve operational and personnel problems? Who on our staff now has the experience with collective bargaining? Didn’t our Mayor say he would get all contracts signed 5 years ago and he only got 1 out of 7 completed? Does our Mayor need 40+ hours a year of additional education to deal with changing government regulations or new procedures a city has to have in place? Should a government have to react to every crisis rather than anticipate problems? Example, why did it take a 19 year old fire truck to catch on fire while fighting a fire to be replaced?
Did you hear any of this? Maybe you weren't there and are relying on 'someone' else telling you. That group has never talked Saratoga down, the form of government, but not the City.
7:23 nailed it right; my take is I would rather have someone with a degree in Municipal government and budgets, running departments, rather than a wedding planner or cemetery director. Remember, the burden is on the elected officials to control a Manager, not the other way around.
I like the idea of the city manager getting 3 months salary w/o cause and 0 months with cause being put in there regarding termination. What I still don't get is why we are paying them a big base anyway.
We're told these people are "professionals" and essentially, there job is to do little more then manage the cities assets. If that's the case, why not set up the position like a financial planner. Put them on commission. They get a percentage of what they earn us.
Figure out a way to reign in union contracts - get a chunk of the savings. Switch to a volunteer fire company - get a chunk of the savings. Lower taxes - get a chunk of the savings. Don't give these managers a chance to be part of the system, make sure they ONLY get paid if they improve it.
4:36pm or should I say Pat,your rants are just that and will not sell in this city if there's anybody who hasn't a clue it is you,so far you're 0 for 4 in your personal attempt at changing what the majority in this successful city have rejected over and over again,face it you are running against the people of saratoga springs,you wanna bet on making it 0for5,even with wilkes and martins' money..getta life.
5:14 I agree with you on the manager's termination. However, if you look at a job description of a City Manager I think you will be surprised, and they don't command the size salaries that have been floating around 130 thousand and up. Saratoga isn't that large of a city and our budget is not the size of one. With all these 5 & 6 story buildings going up, it's getting harder to argue for a volunteer fire company and if we get one our homeowners insurance rates would go through the roof.
Wei have seen how these salaries get out of control with any executive positions (think Marcia White and Ed Spychalski). The executive sets the agenda for the board and presents information which supports whatever position or expendature he/she is asking the board to make. This includes sweet heart contracts for him self and his buddies (politics is always about the contracts). As the council moves further and further away from the day yo day operations of the city the more they become totally dependent on the executive manager. Soon all decisions are just rubber stamped or never brought to the board at all. This city is a jewel. don't ruin it.
@6:14 - Regarding fire safety, it's time we moved beyond our antiquated ideas on what's best. For years unions, like the IAFF, have been more concerned about protecting the jobs of their members then the lives and property of the citizens who pay their salaries. Fire Supression systems offer far greater protection then our current system ever will.
If we want to offer our citizens the best opportunity to be safe from fire, we'd be better off scaling back our current fire department, and using the money saved to offer tax incentives for the installation of supression systems. A supression system will do more to being your insurance down then 1,000,000 firefighters ever will. Make them mandatory in all new construction in the area as well.
As far as the the salary of the "City Manager" goes, I don't care if it's $130,000 or $90,000 or even $55,000 - it's too much guaranteed money. It needs to be a commission driven position. You want to earn money, then make the citizens money. Streamline departments and cut waste, find way to increase sales tax revenue without raising the actual sales tax, negotiate better contracts with city unions, or find groups who we can outsource the work to. We don't need another mouth to feed.
I would envision an effective "city manager" system working alot like a successful commerical building contractor. Surround yourself with competent and affordable sub-contractors ( in this case they'd handle things like DPW duties, human resources, and public safety) and approach cities with a "bid" on how you can run their city better for less money. The approach of Saratoga Citizen seems to be simply to give us another group of mouths to feed, and another layer of bureaucracy to protect incompetent unions.
Can a City Manager dictate the closing times for bars on Caroline Street?
It's a toxic area, the guy in the photo would be a good bouncer....except for the flowers.
Awww John-- Do you beat this horse to death just for the applause of your adoring readership? WHATEVER it is, this surely isn't your finest display of your World-Class intelligence.
So many times here, you go off on childish mean-spirited attacks on Wilkes and Kane... baseless attacks at that.
Yet with pen still smoking, you have the audacity to write--
"(Kane is) so blinded by his anger against Johnson..."
A far more certifiably true moment of introspection would lead you to write "(Tighe is) so blinded by his anger against Wilkes and Kane..."
It's just so damn disappointing to see you stoop so low when your reputation has been built on higher moral turf. But hey, your adoring readers DO eat it up.
Direct your venom at the CERTIFIED snakes-- Raniere, Marcia, BedBug Ed, Live Nation, Toothy...
...or you can simply spout off a few more paragraphs of blind anger.
I am a Republican and I too was at the Republican meeting you speak of. The crowd was actually very friendly. This is a "Charter Evolution" is actually a very wise decision. The political parties struggle to find candidates, our “management of departments" leaves a lot to be desired. Kane pointed out that this is "natural evolution". And I believe him.
You are right; Kane is a good guy with good intentions for the city. . I spoke with him after the meeting and is very informative and had no beef with Johnson other that his opposition to Charter.
I never realized he was so involved with so many organizations. The Chamber of Commerce Board, Saratoga Hospital Board, and The Children’s Museum Board, First Night Saratoga, Unlimited Potential Board, and nearly a decade of Design Review Commission.
I really think that level of involvement is impressive.
This no grudge match...it is really a natural evolution.
By the Way ask the Republican crowd how they feel about Scott Johnson..
Kyle,kyle, Kyle I don't "hate" anyone. That kind of anger is reserved for tyrants and despots. Unfortunately my opposition seems to think Johnson is both.
I believe they just don't like being shut out of power.
You might win the battle,but it will be the worst thing to hit Saratoga since Urban Renewal.
And when you tell me I was right {I am} I really won't feel any better
1:28pm..stick to zoning matters,and stop defending the liberal agenda not very becoming for a republican committee person don't you agree?
The republican crowd likes Johnson or how else would he keep getting elected,we know some of the "RINO'S"on the republican committee don't like him but they don't like themselves and probably should be weeded out.
1:28 is a propagandist and is in bed with saratoga citizens he's on the rep.comm.and if he was really at the meeting I was at he won't in all honesty say what he has said,we don't want to be like watertown ny,we want a mayoral commission set up.
JT,The thing I didn't like about Pat Kane is this.. he stood up in front of the Commitee and proudly announced HE was a Republican(which as you can imagine brought out alot lot of snickering) but he never told us why he worked so hard for the the last three democratic mayoral candidates and against Johnson seems to be alittle dishonesty here,what say you kile?
Whatever "dishonesty" there is around here comes in on little cat feet answering to the name "Johnson."
How 'bout you stop wasting City money on your personal Charter fight? How 'bout you stop handing bs to the Saratogian about your maybe/possible Charter Commission? How 'bout you respect the Law AND the 2300 petitioning citizens? How 'bout you recognize the FOUR YEARS of open meetings and public transparency?
HOW 'BOUT you let JT and his fans and let ALL the voters be the ones to chastise Wilkes and Kane and York and let them be publicly humiliated by John's enlightened hundreds voting NO NO NO!!!!
To put it simply--
Where's the Honor, Your Honor?
Is Johnson the same Mayor who has never put any of his "fellow" Republican council candidates on his own lawn.
Scott Johnson barely beat his last opponent by 300 votes.
The bed bug issue alone will never allow him another chance at Mayor.
Kane certainly has not been a flag waving member of our party, but I have bigger issues with a "teammate" who wants things his way all the time.
Scott is a lame duck!!
He could care less about the Republican Party or fellow saratogians.
The Republican Party could care less about him.
And I was at the meeting too. I went to see Tony Jordan not Pat Kane. I am voting for Charter reform, it is long overdue.
What's long overdue is the end of political predictions by idiots.
I also was at the Republican Comm. meeting to hear Tony Jordan but found the details of Charter Change very interesting and since have visited the YouTube site to see the visiting City Manager speaking at the Library. Of course if you ask our committee face to face if they are for the change they will say no (to honor Jasper's 'no tell if asked' policy), however in private conversations many are for it. As for Scott Johnson, if anybody would have wanted to run as Mayor on the Republican ticket we would probably asked Scott not to run or primary him. He has lost the confidence of the Party with his actions and non actions and with his and other members of our committee’s closeness with this blog host which is certainly not looked at as politically favorable add all these up and it will certainly be a disadvantage in the next election.
You are so full of shit.Would you like to go on the record and identity yourself or just blow smoke out your ass from behind your computer
11:12 Re fire Safty
You had better look at the Mayors Office and how they are running the building department.
We currently have multipul building in the City that are supposed to have fire sprinklers in them but the Shauna Sutton has said that is too expensive for the building owners. "The inspectors have enough work and will not bother with this"
Someting is going to happen in this City and it will not be good for the Name of Saratoga
Pat Kane was never on the Board of the chamber of Commerce
@11:16 - I would recommend you bring that to John's attention, and I'm sure he'd look into it for you. Or better yet, maybe Citizen Kane could do that.... or do city managers only care about the safety and good will of the public when their check clears?
If what you're saying is true those accusations are serious and should be followed up on. I'm looking forward to hearing more, and hoping that John will shed some light on things if we have city businesses operating without safety measures in place.
At very least, if you feel the city, and our current form of goverment is so ineffective and crooked that these fire safety issues will NEVER be addressed, I hope you will at least make you fellow citizens aware of these businesses and buildings, so we can not only steer clear of them for our own safety, but also be sure not to frequent establishments who disregard the safety of our citizens.
7/17 @ 8:12 AM
You should check your facts again.
Pat Kane was on the Chamber Board.
I often sat next to him at chamber Board meetings.
It was shortly after his successful efforts to start First Night Saratoga. I think it was 2000 or 2001. The guy has done plenty of volunteer work for this community.
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